Are we victims of circumstance or do we choose our circumstance?

Homepage Forums Small Talk Are we victims of circumstance or do we choose our circumstance?

This topic contains 47 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by  PopeBeanie 2 weeks, 1 day ago.

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  • #29143

    Unseen
    Participant

    @jakelafort

    But where do you think the feelings you experience in your consciousness come from?

    Your preconscious mind.

    #29146

    jakelafort
    Participant

    Unseen, what did i write that made ya think i was disagreeing with notion that feelings are in preconscious mind?

    Jody Lee, i second Reg in giving my approval…not that my approval should mean anything to ya. Simple thing but it is so valuable…we all have a strong tendency to dig the fuck in to our ideas and be more about fighting to be RIGHT than having an open mind amenable to change based on reason.

    #29150

    PopeBeanie
    Moderator

    Consciousness is one of the inputs used in the preconscious mind. We are conscious of getting on a bike and getting the hang of it, but all the consciousness is there is as an input to the preconscious mind, which is where things are DONE and not just perceived.

    Human consciousness in particular is extremely (if not unnaturally) influential in decision making, and can even override naturally evolved unconscious behaviors as deeply embedded as (say) breathing or heart rate. The joy of arts like music, speech, dance, solving mathematical problems, or having intellectual conversations could not exist without a consciousness that’s able to focus on such things intentionally.

    Sure, the unconscious mind and in fact physiology of the body serves as a platform at all times during conscious experiences. But most importantly, even you admit (above) that consciousness serves as an input to the preconscious mind. Maybe the main difference between your view and mine is how relevant we claim this consciousness is in determining thoughts and behavior.

    Now, for the sake of additional contemplation (including for Jody’s consideration), I’ll repeat something I say often about “free will”, but have just decided here and now to use the term willpower instead, with hopes to further conversational progress. We can ignore my loose definition of free will, and avoid the conventional dualist’s or other wooist’s precise but flawed definition (or your strict definition) of free will. So for the sake of argument…

    I propose that willpower exists, married to a scale of one’s abilities or potential abilities. No matter what one wants and tries to accomplish with willpower, one’s ultimate success depends on 1) one’s perseverance, 2) one’s physical and mental capabilities (including experience), and 3) one’s environmental circumstances, including randomness in opportunities that just happen to be present at the time. All of those variables usually lie somewhere on a scale between all or nothing, one or zero. Often, even the success or failure of one’s endeavor also lies on a scale, somewhere between pure success vs pure failure.

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