Rats or Roaches or…?

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This topic contains 53 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by  jakelafort 3 months, 1 week ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 54 total)
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  • #32190

    _Robert_
    Participant

    Query whether Trump supporting breeders might ever produce intelligent offspring. Is mutation or genetic diversity insufficient to do so? In all of his travels Darwin may have never encountered such stagnation.

    That’s pretty funny. I always try to understand all major points of view, however Twitterman doesn’t seem to represent anything at all. Not a classic republican. Was a NY democrat rich kid. Just a twisted agenda of self-interest that seems to have failed him. Mostly a racist point of view of maximum death and suffering to the vulnerable and beneficiary to the super rich, I guess.

    #32191

    jakelafort
    Participant

    Robert, the be-all, end-all, tell-all is scheduled to be released on July 14. Too Much and Never Enough promises to be a bigger seller than the bible. Am hoping to procure a copy lickety split.

    #32192

    Am hoping to procure a copy lickety split.

    I think it wise not to hold your breath. The Mazars might get lazier. But maybe Mr. Vance could prove to be the new King Cyrus and herald in an era of disclosure.

    #32193

    Unseen
    Participant

    Dogs have a bigger brain by weight per body size, but cats are somewhat smarter (smart enough to make testing them a challenge, LOL). How can that be? A wrinklier brain surface! So brain surface area related to body size/’weight is a better measure of potential for intelligence.

    #32194

    jakelafort
    Participant

    Makes sense Unseen. So dogs are Trump supporters with tongues out and tails wagging…faithful to their master irrespective of master’s intentions and behavior..and cats are more like the rest of us..a bit independent, harder to please and at least a modicum of skepticism and acumen.

    #32195

    Unseen
    Participant

    Makes sense Unseen. So dogs are Trump supporters with tongues out and tails wagging…faithful to their master irrespective of master’s intentions and behavior..and cats are more like the rest of us..a bit independent, harder to please and at least a modicum of skepticism and acumen.

    and dignity.

    #32196

    Simon Paynton
    Participant

    If each species is intelligent in a way that is adapted to their natural niche – humans are adapted to a risky niche, so we need to be flexible and adaptable in our intelligence.  We also need hands, in my opinion, so that we can make and operate technology, among other things.  Ours is like the Windows or English Language of intelligence – general all-purpose, and good at incorporating or learning new things.

    #32197

    jakelafort
    Participant

    Being adapted to a niche is universal. Isn’t it aesthetic to conceive it as intelligent in what amounts to survivability? We certainly will not credit any animal operating on instinct alone as being intelligent. (There is a deeper issue here-if the universe is determined is intelligence itself aesthetic?)

    So unless animals exhibit some understanding of their environment, of issues, theory of mind, problem solving unfamiliar issues…etc..it is not really intelligence.

    #32198

    Unseen
    Participant

    We also need hands, in my opinion, so that we can make and operate technology, among other things.

    Careful. That sounds just a wee bit teleological.

    #32199

    Unseen
    Participant

    Huge for a creature with an exoskeleton, the coconut crab is probably the upper limit in terms of size.

    #32200

    Simon Paynton
    Participant

    Careful. That sounds just a wee bit teleological.

    I just mean that hands make it easier to make and manipulate technology.  I know that crows can use their beaks and octopuses their tentacles.

    #32201

    #32202

    Karuna
    Participant
    #32203

    Davis
    Participant

    I’d be careful to assume that cat’s selfish “fuck you I’ll do what I want” attitude as some evidence of higher intelligence. Sure, they seem to get a much better bargain in the human animal relationship, that is getting a shelter food and attention (whenever the cat feels like it) but that probably has more to do with a much different co-evolution between humans and cats then per humans with dogs, cats being a convenient pest control and maybe companion vs. dogs extreme malleability as protector, Sheppard, hunter, laborer and undeniable companion. Their loyalty comes from their own wolf-like pack mentality and a close evolution with man kind. I would say that our ability to currently train dogs to be so many different kinds of assistance animals, requiring extreme self control, human emotional sensitivity and extensive training certainly says a lot about a dogs ability to adapt. I see a lot fewer cat assistance animals. Is that because cat’s couldn’t be bothered to do so or lack the social and intellectual skills to be properly trained?

    In my own personal experience, I didn’t find owning a cat a particularly rewarding experience. It was a very lopsided relationship and the benefits of having her around were outweighed by the responsibilities. When you needed her for companionship she was nowhere to be found or loathed being touched and when it wanted companionship it wouldn’t relent demanding it even if you were busy or it seriously inconvenienced you. When we got a dog the house was transformed. The dog was far more emotionally sensitive to us and was very easily trained. The cat was really nasty to the dog and tended to disappear for longer stretches of time than before (she would already go away for two or three days, leaving us worried, one time ending up with a broken leg from being hit by a car). I found the cat the least adaptive pet and if it were up to me I would have replaced it with two dogs.

    #32204

    Unseen
    Participant

    Careful. That sounds just a wee bit teleological.

    I just mean that hands make it easier to make and manipulate technology. I know that crows can use their beaks and octopuses their tentacles.

    But crows don’t have beaks so that they can drop rocks into a jar to make the floating food come into reaching distance. That’s what I meant by teleology. We don’t have body parts or faculties because we’ll need them at some future time.

    • This reply was modified 3 months, 2 weeks ago by  Unseen.
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