War in Europe. It has begun.

Homepage Forums Politics War in Europe. It has begun.

This topic contains 135 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by  TheEncogitationer 3 months, 2 weeks ago.

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  • #41456

    Unseen
    Participant

    Ukrainian invasion, first day.

    Now, bear in mind that today’s weapons of conventional warfare are orders of magnitude more lethal than the corresponding weapons available to both sides (short of the atom bomb, of course) in WW2. Smart bombs, laser-guided missiles, tactical nukes, antitank missiles as well as explosive tank armor, helicopters armed to the teeth with Gatling guns and other high-tech offensive weapons, winged aircraft carrying high precision bombs, antiaircraft missiles, and on and on and on. At the same time, the weaponry carried by modern infantry is high tech compared with the weapons carried by soldiers in WW2.

    And let’s not even get into drone warfare, where the attacking country can inflict massive casualties at relatively low cost without risking even one person on their own side.

     

    #41457

    Cyber warfare is also an important weapon that Russia is using.

    #41460

    Unseen
    Participant

    Cyber warfare is also an important weapon that Russia is using.

    I was aware of that but somehow it didn’t enter my mind when I wrote that post. Even so, I was writing about the magnified physical destructive power of today’s weapons. Cyberwarfare is useful for sowing confusion mostly.

    #41464

    Unseen
    Participant

    Let’s also not forget who’s watching Russia to see how effectively NATO and the U.S. respond. China’s Xi, who wants to absorb Taiwan and North Korea’s Kim, who thinks how rich and powerful he’d be if he governed a reunified Korea.

    Putin has been making it clear lately that he’d be willing to launch nukes if he feels threatened or thwarted. The (dis)loyal opposition is making fun of Biden’s supposed weakness, and yet at the same time I have seen no suggestions as to how to counter a dictator who’s threatening WW3 if he can’t get his way.

    #41468

    TheEncogitationer
    Participant

    Unseen and Fellow Unbelievers,

    WOLVERIIIINES!
    Exclusive: Ukraine Calls On Hacker Underground To Defend Against Russia
    https://www.reuters.com/world/exclusive-ukraine-calls-hacker-underground-defend-against-russia-2022-02-24/

    And…

    Ukrainian president’s last minute call for citizens to take up arms, fight the Russians: ‘You will see our faces, not our backs’
    https://www.bizpacreview.com/2022/02/24/ukrainian-presidents-last-minute-call-for-citizens-to-take-up-arms-fight-the-russians-you-will-see-our-faces-not-our-backs-1205015/

    • This reply was modified 4 months ago by  TheEncogitationer. Reason: Addendum. More to come I'm sure
    #41470

    Autumn
    Participant

    If I were to bet money, I’d bet against this escalating into full scale war. But I’d also only be willing to be upwards of a nickel.

    I don’t support wars of aggression, and I don’t agree with Russia’s actions to the extent I’ve understood them over the last… eight years? Seven? I will say I feel people around me are simplifying the political situation in eastern Ukraine. I’ve known people from those parts whose first and only language until learning English was Russian. Parts of Ukraine are, to my understanding, very Russian. That doesn’t mean separatism is inherently justified, or that rebellion and bloodshed is justified. It definitely doesn’t justify foreign interference. But sometimes it feels like there is such a knee jerk reaction to Russia that anything going on with the native inhabitants beyond Russia’s actions just gets swallowed up and lost.

    #41471

    _Robert_
    Participant

    Seems the free world is trying to move on and is done and over with invasions and land grabs that harp back to previous centuries of bloody imperialism. Saddam Hussein is a case in point. Unfortunately, authoritarian regimes team up and help each other survive the sanctions the free world imposes.

    #41474

    Unseen
    Participant

    Seems the free world is trying to move on and is done and over with invasions and land grabs that harp back to previous centuries of bloody imperialism. Saddam Hussein is a case in point. Unfortunately, authoritarian regimes team up and help each other survive the sanctions the free world imposes.

    A friend in need is a friend in deed. The difference a space makes.

    But, Putin has become a pain in the rectum for Premier Xi.

    #41476

    TheEncogitationer
    Participant

    Fellow Unbelievers,

    It’s one thing to oppose military involvement in action against Russia and fully understandable, but actively supporting Putin’s Russia in the name of Christian Nationalism is just a whole other level of reprehensible:

    Commies to the Left of me!
    Christers to the Right!
    Here I am, ducking a two-way hit-job!

    #41477

    _Robert_
    Participant

    It actually takes work to be that ignorant.

    #41494

    TheEncogitationer
    Participant

    Robert,

    I call her Lauren “Witchie” Witzke. 😁

    I guess she didn’t know that the Ukranians are also majority Orthodox Christians. And if what Putin is doing is “taking care of people,” I’d rather live hard-scrabble.

    #41495

    TheEncogitationer
    Participant

    Fellow Unbelievers,

    Speaking of Orthodox, here’s some news and analysis about Patriarch Kirill, The Head-Muthah-In-Charge of the State-sponsored Russian Orthodon Church:

    Ukraine conflict – Moscow Patriarch Kirill calls for prayer for peace
    Edit Author: Thema Newsroom | Published: February 25, 2022

    Ukraine conflict – Moscow Patriarch Kirill calls for prayer for peace

    Notice how The Patriarch doesn’t even mention or place blame on Putin and speaks of both the Russian aggressors and the Ukrainians defending themselves as if they are moral equals!

    Someone else noticed this too and was not happy:

    BY KATHERINE KELAIDIS FEBRUARY 25, 2022
    NO, PATRIARCH KIRILL OF MOSCOW IS NOT CALLING FOR PEACE — IN FACT, HE’S PUTIN’S ACCOMPLICE

    No, Patriarch Kirill of Moscow is Not Calling for Peace — In Fact, He’s Putin’s Accomplice

    And they claim that religion has a monopoly oj morality! Feh! 🙄

    #41498

    Unseen
    Participant

    Those of us of a certain age will immediately recognize Vladimir Pozner, who for years toward the end of the USSR was a mouthpiece for the USSR’s PR efforts. Nowadays, he’s an independent and learned political commentator on current affairs who lives, not in Moscow but in Paris. He says it’s distressing how much the fear of nuclear weapons has gone by the wayside, especially at the top levels of both the Russian and American governments.

     

     

    #41500

    Unseen
    Participant

    In related news…

    #41501

    Unseen
    Participant

    There’s a very good chance you have never heard of “thermobaric weapons” or, if you have heard of them, don’t have a clear idea what they are.

    Not to put too fine a point on it, they are the most terrifying weapon in any country’s arsenal short of nuclear weapons.

    and Russia is bringing them into Ukraine as I write:

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