Is there evidence that new races of man appeared coinceding with biblical Adam?

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This topic contains 139 replies, has 11 voices, and was last updated by  michael17 1 year, 5 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 106 through 120 (of 140 total)
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  • #8242

    I would not rely on accounts (allegedly) by Josephus as being trustworthy. Tacitus would not have me jumping for joy. I certainly would not use either as evidence for a worldview.

    Michael do you think you will become immortal?

     

    #8243

    michael17
    Participant

    Only if they are historians.

    #8244

    michael17
    Participant

    I would not rely on accounts (allegedly) by Josephus as being trustworthy. Tacitus would not have me jumping for joy. I certainly would not use either as evidence for a worldview. Michael do you think you will become immortal?

    Well that’s promised to believers.

    #8245

    I know Michael but I asked if you believe it.

    #8247

    Simon Paynton
    Participant

    Well that’s promised to believers.

    – I don’t understand the logic of this, it seems like a very disproportionate prize, considering what you have to do to get it, or not do to not get it.  God just cannot care if I don’t “like” Him (like I don’t like anything else I don’t believe in), or don’t believe in Him.  I certainly do not care about those things, so I must be better than God straight off.

    #8248

    michael17
    Participant

    I know Michael but I asked if you believe it.

     

    I believe it can happen and I hope I will.  I hope my life will always attest to my faith before judgement day.;showing enough love and enough putting to death of the man of sin which is buried in baptism that I may be raised on that day.

     

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by  michael17.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by  michael17.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by  michael17.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by  michael17.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by  michael17.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by  michael17.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by  michael17.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by  michael17.
    #8260

    I believe it can happen and I hope I will….

    I think Michael that this is one of the main differences between theists and atheists. I find it unbelievable to think we could become immortals. By “unbelievable” I mean I am unable to believe it. It is a proposition that my mind could never give its assent to. I also have no hope or desire for it. This life is sufficient for me. I find it rather sad that so many people seem to spend this life preparing themselves for another life, of which there is zero evidence to suggest is a viable proposition.

    It is like when I hear people tell me that they have conversations with their God. What they are telling me is that they can hold conversations with the Creator of the Universe, which I also find myself incapable of believing.

    What you are telling me Michael, or at least what I am hearing, is that you believe that it is possible that you will exist in some form in 20 billion years time as an immortal. Is that a correct assessment of your belief?

    #8263

    michael17
    Participant

    Reg:

    ”What you are telling me Michael, or at least what I am hearing, is that you believe that it is possible that you will exist in some form in 20 billion years time as an immortal. Is that a correct assessment of your belief?”

    Science’s answer to the anthropic principle is the Mult-verse which is unfalsiable. I choose God, equally unfalsifiable. As such I choose to live forever. My scientific and engineering training refuses to let me attribute life and it is engineering with fine tuning, just as the parameters to the universe ,to happenstance.

    The miracle of 3D vision with color consistancy is tipping the

    iceberg.

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by  michael17.
    #8265

    michael17
    Participant

    We can imbue a robot with binocular vision but not binocular perception with color consistency. Mutation, DNA replication errors and survival of the fittest do not engineer let alone miraculously.

    #8266

    _Robert_
    Participant

    We can imbue a robot with binocular vision but not binocular perception with color consistency. Mutation, DNA replication errors and survival of the fittest do not engineer let alone miraculously.

    Argument from ignorance. Religion requires a closed mind. The mind is a terrible thing to taste. Or waste.

    #8267

    Davis
    Participant

    @michael

    Okay. Thanks for the clarification. I take it then that you use metaphors a lot, which is one way of saying: you don’t really mean a lot of things that you say. It’s difficult to take someone seriously when their text is littered with possible metaphors. I recommend using them VERY sparringly. In my hunble opinion.

    #8268

    Davis
    Participant

    Reg: ”What you are telling me Michael, or at least what I am hearing, is that you believe that it is possible that you will exist in some form in 20 billion years time as an immortal. Is that a correct assessment of your belief?” Science’s answer to the anthropic principle is the Mult-verse which is unfalsiable. I choose God, equally unfalsifiable. As such I choose to live forever. My scientific and engineering training refuses to let me attribute life and it is engineering with fine tuning, just as the parameters to the universe ,to happenstance. The miracle of 3D vision with color consistancy is tipping the iceberg.

    Michael. That’s a lot of text sort of answering Reg’s question, and then spending most of the time on questions no one asked you. I can take everything you wrote and sum it up as:

    Yes. I will exist as an immortal in 10,000,000 years.

    Is that the case? Please try not to digress into the anthropic principle or 3D vision and your engineering background. It’s a simple YES/NO question.

    #8269

    I used to keep a running tally of the amount of times a theist would answer of my questions about their faith by referring to something in the realm of Science.

    Me: Do you believe your God created humans in the “form” we are found in today?

    Theist: It makes more sense than descending from monkeys.

    Me: That is not what I asked you. You don’t understand evolutionary theory.

    Theist: God is a more plausible answer. It just makes sense.

    Or

    Me: I am asking you about why you believe your God is real. You keep talking about M-theory and Multiverses. Why is that?

    Theists: Just because I am a theist it doesn’t mean I don’t like Science.

    Me: We were talking about God. OK, so do you think the “cold spot” in the radiation produced when this Universe was formed over 13 billion years ago was more likely caused by a collision with another Universe given the mathematical problems it implies for Inflationary Theory?

    Theist: It could be so.

    Me: Why do you think so?

    Theist: Anything is possible to God?

    Me: God did not create the Multiverse. It is not possible.

    Theist: Of course it is. Why do you say it is not?

    Me: In a multiverse, a Universe without God would have to exist. So there is a Universe where everyone on Earth is an atheist. However, if every possible (infinite) Universe exists within the Multiverse then there must exist one Universe not created by God. Therefore it is not possible. It is the same problem as the rock that God cannot lift.

    Theist: Anything and everything is possible to God.

    Me: OK without mentioning anything Scientific please answer 3 questions with a “Yes” or “No” reply only;

    Do you believe a God created the Universe that we exist in? Y/N.

    Do you believe you have the ability to hold conversations (via prayer) with this God? Y/N.

    Do you believe you will become an immortal like your God in the “next life”? Y/N.

    #8270

    michael17
    Participant

    @Reg

    LOL, let me alleviate some of your frustration:

    Do you believe a God created the Universe that we exist in?

    Y

    Do you believe you have the ability to hold conversations (via prayer) with this God?

    N

    Do you believe you will become an immortal like your God in the “next life”?

    Y

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by  michael17.
    #8272

    Can you explain the immortality idea further please?

    Are you already immortal?  I mean when this life is over do you go straight to Heaven, with no noticeable time loss (even though Time has become redundant at that point). If that is the case you would technically be an immortal now.

    Could it be that after you die do you “wait” for X amount of time in your grave until your God, the Creator of the Universe(s) returns and has a Day of Judgement?

    To be honest Catholics have me very confused. They say there will be a Day of Judgement when Jesus returns and then takes the faithful or “true Christians” to Heaven and I will take the stairs all the way down. No problem with that bit.

    However then they say some people they call saints are already in Heaven and that these saints intercede with God on their behalf. I am not sure why they need this facility as they can also pray directly to God and Jesus or Mary. Anyway what that means is that humans – i.e. the Popes – can somehow bypass the Day of Judgement and send certain folk directly to Heaven, thus making them immortal before all the other faithful. I can understand how this works and Catholics seem unable to explain it to me. I cannot find anything about this in the Bible.

    I do know the verse about not judging others is there but Catholics must break this and assume that the potential saint they never met is without sin. I also ask them if the dead person being made a saint is corporeally reassembled if (say) they were burnt at the stake 600 years ago. I know Julia Sweeney once asked two Mormon if she would get her original nose back in Heaven or would she get to keep the new one she had invested money in and was happier with. How does the dead person get to Heaven when they are made a saint? I mean they can’t already be there, in Heaven, if their God has not returned for the Day of Judgement. What is the point of Jesus doing an encore if people are already in Heaven?

    I have a lot more to ask them but they usually are fast to anger with me at this point. Some will even use abusive language towards me but I always tell them I forgive them and that I am prepared to turn the other cheek which seems to confuse them even further. I would love to get to the bottom of this theological nightmare so that I could help them out. Any help would be appreciated.

    When I consider the idea of immortality for humans I always reject it. I am reminded of the Woody Allen quip that infinity is a very long time especially towards the end. What do you do all day? I think the Irish comedian Dave Allen understood them and the last joke at 12:09 explains Catholic Heaven.

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