Sunni Islam and Shia Islam Together Again…And Against Us!

[jakelafortParticipant]

Enco,

Both Palestinians and Jews have legit claims to that land. Difference is Jews took what they were granted and were happy about it. Palestinians and coalition of Arabs attacked. The mindset of Arabs and Palestinians is same then as now.

The interesting and telling thing from my perspective is the hyperfocus on Zionism. I’ve explained it from a historical perspective how urgent the clarion call for a Jewish homeland. You can see already and will continue to see AJ reaction. Hamas got what they wanted. Masterful job. I could go on for hours as could anyone who has a passing knowledge of history to give example after example of lands taken with less justification and instead naked unprovoked aggression. But it is the Jews as always who have the microscope on them while the rest of the world gets a telescope. If there were no Jews in Palestine and say Jordan had that land that is Israel and Palestinians were in same place they are do you suppose the focus would be a tenth of what it is? How is that for a rhetorical question? Jews in Israel have dome some bad shit to the Palestinians and the Orthodox Jews are a problem. (BTW i would say the same thing about Orthodox Jews that i said about Palestinians and Arabs in surrounding countries. Frozen in time. Same attitudes. Mindless robots all!) That just goes to show you that Jews are human like the rest of the world.

[—Participant]

jakelafort wrote:

There was no nonsequitur. So it is not beneath me. Palestinians according to Pew are overwhelmingly religious. Yes a smattering of Christians but mostly Muslims. The Palestinians according to Pew in that world research that attempted to account for antisemitism (how about AJ for antijewish) discovered (no surprise) that the greater middle east and Palestinian territory is rabidly antisemitic

This has fuck all to do with my statements. You say it’s not a non-sequitur then double down on a non-sequitur. You’re arguing against a point no one is making and doing so with cheap caricature. Sorry champ, but while this may not be beneath you, it’s beneath me.

 

[UnseenParticipant]

jakelafort wrote:

Both Palestinians and Jews have legit claims to that land. Difference is Jews took what they were granted and were happy about it. Palestinians and coalition of Arabs attacked. The mindset of Arabs and Palestinians is same then as now.

And why wouldn’t the Jews be happy? They had the gift givers handing them the long end of the stick, didn’t they?

Not Israel’s 9/11, but a Prison Riot

For nearly two decades, the Gaza Strip has been bottled up and almost completely blocked off. It has been widely compared to an open-air prison. Israel and the United States have tried to seal Gaza, isolating its nearly 2 million residents on a tiny, impoverished strip of land. Washington and Tel Aviv thought that would let them keep Hamas at arm’s length.

Instead, it just turned Gaza into an overcrowded penal colony where the most radicalized and violent gang leaders eventually gained control. Mass murder and hostage taking have been the result.

Sealing off Gaza didn’t solve anything. Instead, its problems festered until they finally exploded last weekend.

[jakelafortParticipant]

More cheese!

Unseen this is just like Russia/Ukraine. Keep trotting out right wing sources and taking a position that is as tendentious and pretentious as a mensch with a wrench draining oil in a trench

[UnseenParticipant]

jakelafort wrote:

More cheese! Unseen this is just like Russia/Ukraine. Keep trotting out right wing sources and taking a position that is as tendentious and pretentious as a mensch with a wrench draining oil in a trench

The Intercept. Right wing. Really?

Left is right; right is left in Upside Down Land.

To put it more poetically:

There once was a fellow named Jake,
In denial, the wrong path he did take.
Left is right and right is left.
Of his mind, he’s bereft.
Refusing to admit his mistake.

[TheEncogitationerParticipant]

Jake,

There is much truth in what you say and my support of Israel does not mean I support either Israel’s version of the Religious Right or the Socialist Kibbutzim. I basically favor Israel because it is much closer to a Secular, Freethinking, Free-Market Capitalist society than it’s enemy neighbors, while also acknowledging there’s always much room for improvement.

The root word of “COEXIST” is “EXIST.” And the word “FREE” needs to apply to both Israel and Palestine.

• This reply was modified 11 months, 1 week ago by  TheEncogitationer. Reason: Removing redundancy...and repetition too. 😉

[jakelafortParticipant]

Here is a little humor injected into the Palestinian/Jewish tragedy. If you have not seen it please watch.

And then they have sex and it is very funny.

[jakelafortParticipant]

I am going to refrain and hold in abeyance some of my thoughts but i want this to be emphasized. Ask yourself how stability is possible when minds are intentionally being infected by racist lies. I have read some of the texts. They’re almost beyond belief in how far they go and yet there is literally nothing that ignorant religious people will reject when it is on their menu.

Loathing for Israel and Jews is ingrained in a region where the official cultures demonize not only specific actions and policies of the state of Israel, but even its very existence. Several Arab governments provide their people cradle-to-grave indoctrination in raw anti-Semitism. Their education systems, government media, and state-financed clergy bombard citizens with the view that Jews must be hated and feared for theological, political, and social reasons.

Saudi Arabia’s public schools, for example, instruct that Jews “obey the devil” and are those whom “God has cursed and with whom He is so angry that He will never again be satisfied.” The Saudi edition of the Koran injects the phrase “such as the Jews” into the opening chapter, following the clause “those who have incurred your [God’s] wrath.”
Of all the anti-Jewish influences in the region, one of the most prevalent and potent is The Protocols of the Elders of Zion. Disseminated with the support and official sanction of the governments of Lebanon, Jordan, Egypt, Libya, Palestine, and Syria, as well as Saudi Arabia and other Gulf states, this work is used to shape the collective consciousness of Arab populations. The Protocols is a century-old fabrication that purports to record the machinations of Jews conspiring to rule the world through treachery, fraud, and violence. Its prose is childish and rambling, as in this excerpt, taken from the eleventh of the 24 protocols: The goyim [non-Jews] are a flock of sheep, and we are their wolves.

[—Participant]

jakelafort wrote:

Saudi Arabia’s public schools…

Are in Saudi Arabia.

 

[TheEncogitationerParticipant]

Autumn,

Ah, but the rulers of Saudi Arabia also bankroll Islamic Madrassahs (religious schools) in the U.S., Canada, and all over the world, which serve as vehicles of Anti-Jewish, Anti-Christian, Anti-Unbeliever, Anti-Western hatred and indoctrination in Islamist theology and ideology.

[TheEncogitationerParticipant]

Jake,

Leaving aside obvious crimes such as incitement and recruitment to Jihad, it is a actually good thing that all of this hatred is on display, so that everyone now knows the extent and sources of the problem and can act to counter it, boycott it, ostracize it, and, where necessary, prepare to fight against all violence that comes to the innocent.

There’s going to be a whole lot of parents saying: “Kids, with my money, you can study Humanities in your spare time and go to a community college to learn IT or Nursing, but not one Cent is going to these hate mills called Ivy League Academia! Enjoy your Eric Hoffer Fellowship!”

• This reply was modified 11 months, 1 week ago by  TheEncogitationer. Reason: Punctuation. No Ivy League required for that. 👨‍🎨👩‍🎨

[UnseenParticipant]

@ Jake

Are you say anyone here is racist or right wing (other than Enco, of course)?

Maybe you missed it when it happened, but the right is the side that tends to support Israel the most (and often for Christian end times beliefs). It’s the left that is most critical of Israel’s government and its over the top oppression of the Palestinians. They do not say Jews are bad or satanic or run the world/banks/Hollywood/etc. Netanyahu, and his administration’s pronouncements sound a lot like they are preparing to commit war crimes.

 

[UnseenParticipant]

j@ Jake and Enco

What Isn’t Taught in Israeli Schools

Israel has always administered and maintained two, segregated schooling systems: one for the Jewish, Hebrew-speaking majority and one for the Palestinian, Arabic-speaking minority. While this arrangement might seem to accommodate sociocultural differences, it in fact upholds the divides that privilege the Jewish majority. Unlike Jewish students who read the literature and poetry of the Zionist movement celebrating the establishment of Israel in 1948, Palestinian students do not read the Palestinian literary classics taught throughout the Arab world. Nor do they learn about the Nakba or Palestinian history. They are required to learn about Jewish values and culture. Indeed, although Palestinians use Arabic as the language of instruction in their schools, Palestinian students spend many more class hours on the study of Hebrew, Jewish history, and Jewish culture than they do on Arabic literature and history. Moreover, right-wing Israeli politicians routinely defame Palestine’s poet laureate, Mahmoud Darwish, whose work they have tried to ban in both schooling systems. Israel’s former Defense Minister Avigdor Lieberman once called Darwish’s poems “fuel for terror attacks.”

The Israeli state has always perceived the Palestinian national-cultural identity as a threat to the Jewish nature of Israel. The education system thus serves a dual role: as a nationalizing apparatus for Jews and as a denationalizing apparatus for Palestinians. It does so by promoting Zionist narratives and erasing the Palestinian national identity. To show solidarity with the plight of Palestinians is to defy the main tenet of the Israeli education system.

[—Participant]

TheEncogitationer wrote:

Autumn, Ah, but the rulers of Saudi Arabia also bankroll Islamic Madrassahs (religious schools) in the U.S., Canada, and all over the world, which serve as vehicles of Anti-Jewish, Anti-Christian, Anti-Unbeliever, Anti-Western hatred and indoctrination in Islamist theology and ideology.

You may be shocked to learn that none of these places are the Gaza nor West Bank Palestinian enclaves. Even Saudi Arabia recently wanted to reach some form of accord with Israel. I doubt anyone believes it’s out of some newfound love of Jewish people, but political realities very often temper or even trump ideology. Palestine has to be considered as Palestine, not Saudi Arabia because even with outside support and funding, Palestinians’ political realities are particular to them.

[UnseenParticipant]

@ Jake

Want to talk about disinformation? How about Hamas beheading babies. Whether it happened or not, don’t ask me: I don’t know. However, the Israeli administration is willing to pass this story around even though their own military can’t substantiate it.

My theory is that it goes back to those days nearly a decade ago when Isis was beheading prisoners and making sure they videoed the enterprise. (Eventually, they apparently realized that this was not good PR and forbade the practice.)

Since then, many of us are ready to believe whatever we hear or read. Sadly, much of the dreck comes from sources you’d think we should be able to trust.

So, who is spreading mis/disinformation now. The Hamas side? Not necessarily.

“BEHEADED BABIES” REPORT SPREAD WIDE AND FAST — BUT ISRAEL MILITARY WON’T CONFIRM IT

(The headline was block copied and was all caps to start with. I’m not yelling.)

From the article:

Despite the IDF’s inability to confirm the report, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s spokesperson Tal Heinrich repeated it on Wednesday — a window into how unverified reports become part of the historical record.

The claim about beheaded babies is the latest in a series of harrowing reports that have emerged over the last few days while Israeli forces regained control of communities attacked by Hamas militants. As Israeli officials responded by pledging vengeance and launching a mass bombing campaign over 2 million Palestinians living in the besieged Gaza Strip, reports of Hamas crimes against civilians fueled rage among the public, elected officials, and policymakers.

On Wednesday, President Joe Biden said, “I never really thought that I would see…have confirmed pictures of terrorists beheading children,” only for the White House to later clarify that the president had not seen such photos and was basing his remarks on Heinrich’s comments and media reports. 

Claims that Hamas militants raped several Israeli women have also gone viral, though the allegation has not been thoroughly substantiated, and at least one news outlet has retracted a reference to it. In his remarks on Tuesday, Biden said that women had been “raped, assaulted, paraded as trophies.” 

[Author]

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