fullermingjr

…when you say “faith”, do you include Hinduism or Wiccan in our public square and if so, what would be the point of it all?

Excellent question @robert.  I did not include those other faith systems.  In the context of this thread and the context of my response, specifically referring to Robert Jeffress – a mega-church Baptist Pastor  who supporte…[Read more]

Greetings Anth Dee – @infjempath.  No, your introduction was not too long.  By the way, I happen to NOT be an Atheist but a theist of the christian verity, and I’m black, African American, or whatever were called now days.   I’m very happy that you failed at your attempt!  Of course, @simonpaynton said, “Religious people can be unspeakably crue…[Read more]

Ivy – @asianne, I really don’t know.  I have participated in presidential elections since Ronald Reagan vs President Jimmy Carter.  However, this is truly the first time I am voting for the proverbial “lesser of two evils”, and that would be Joe Biden.  Yet, I don’t really know.  The electorate have already shocked the pollster over and over aga…[Read more]

Greetings – @robert.  I was browsing around and found your comment about Robert Jeffress.  Back in the summer of 2016, he did what he called his “Tour for America”.  Me, being a “good” Christian was curious.  I had not paid much attention to Jeffress but since he was coming to my city and the event was free, I figured – hey, why not.  But I told…[Read more]

@robert you wrote,

I was surprised how many of my fellow musicians/friends revealed their ignorance because of the pandemic coupled with the Floyd murder. I can’t even talk with them about any of this, they loose their minds

I also can’t easily have conversations with some of my black friends and definitely some of my white evangelical friends r…[Read more]

@jakelafort I laughed out loud when you said “hate the sin, not the sinners” tuchet! And thank you for the explanation of the mirror neurons and your take on and evolutionary case for the development of empathy. I recall reading about this somewhere but I don’t recall.  I think we may need to start a new thread to continue.  You brought up some g…[Read more]

@jakelafort, I clearly think slavery is wrong.  I clearly think all of those other things are wrong.  My question wasn’t searching to find out if such things are wrong.  My question was simply looking for a non-religious foundation for it being wrong.  I’m not sure what my future holds, but I hope to encourage more peace in the world in my own lit…[Read more]

@davis, Great response.  It’s the latter, an explanation based on “some rational argument grounded in a reasoned moral system”.  You have provided some excellent material for me to chew on, specifically the idea that “virtue ethics and utilitarian ethics …have had a massive influence on contemporary western ethos [and] human rights”.  Clearly I…[Read more]

@simonpaynton, Simon – thank you for your response.  The idea of upholding or violating a norm, or hindering or promoting a shared value may be a good enough answer to my question.  I’ll have to do more homework because, of course, collective values change over time, but this is a good place to start.  Yet, for just about every society that has ev…[Read more]

@jakelfort – It may seem astonishing, but I am an American Citizen.  I’m also a computer scientist by training so I look for logic.  Putting these two ideas together, in the public square, a faith-based argument cannot be used, thus, I am seeking a non-faith based reason.  BTW, I didn’t bring up religion or Christianity as a basis for co…[Read more]

@jakelafort – we are, in essence, saying the same thing.  The “test” is how PEOPLE operate.  Philosophical constructs don’t do anything.  Sure, they may help a person justify their actions in their own psyche, but it’s people who act.  You guys (Reg, Robert, and yourself) seem to be trying to pick a fight with me – but I’m just trying to find out…[Read more]

But Robert, as I attempt to stay on topic, are you saying that inherently,  Christianity promotes the honoring of Confederate Symbols based on its immoral master/slave philosophy? Whould you also say that non-religious philosophical systems don’t have the ingredients to do the same?

I study the faith deeply and strive to be honest in my…[Read more]

All, great discussion.  I appreciate your responses to my questions.  I consider my self a skeptic and a theist and so I am often critical in a technical sense of the word, of the things I read or hear, regardless of its source.

Reg, your “too long to read” post was fascinating.  It wasn’t what I was asking,  and as you might anticipate,  ther…[Read more]

jakelafort – fair enough, no monolith among atheists, and that’s true about theist, too – of the Christian Variety (which I happen to be)… but my question isn’t meant to oversimplify anything.  Maybe you can speak for yourself.  I’m trying to understand what make owning another person a “violation of decency that it hardly needs e…[Read more]

@_Robert_, I agree – the founders ” kicked the can down the road”.  I also agree that the  Southern states may not have signed on and the split would have occurred in the 1770’s as opposed to in the 1860’s.  The Union may have never formed.  But do you think they could have at least negotiated a path toward abolishing slavery?  This county – I th…[Read more]

Greetings,

Put the Confederate statues in museums!

It’s your friendly theist… who happens to also be the descendant of American Slaves/i.e. African American.  First of all, I laughed out loud when I read “Slavery is the country’s original sin.” and the comment, “Amazing how deep rooted biblical nonsense is rooted even amongst atheists. Just ye…[Read more]